Well, I'm a Dredge Player. If you change Black to White, you not as well just play Sylvan Mentor....
The Better Dredge Hate cards are, in an order of best to worst, imo:
Rest in Peace
Leyline of the Void
Surgical Extraction/ Extirpate
Tormod's Crypt/ Relic of Progenitus/ Bojuka Bog/ Nihil Spellbomb
Note that this is my opinion, not actual fact.
I'm curious which Dredge you're playing? Because in my opinion (from the other side of the matchup), Priest is one of my favorite cards against Dredge.
I play Traditional Dredge. Priest is pretty bad because it doesn't do anything to the Graveyard, it allows Bridge triggers, it allows Dredging, Flashback Therapies, etc. You can pretty much ignore a Priest by dredging into some bridges, cast a creature, then flashback a therapy and make Zombies....
Some of this sounds like deck construction. Why are you playing all these cards you need to play turn 1 along with Wasteland?
I agree with most which has been said in this thread, but I think this quote is particularly important. You've got to ask yourself why you're playing Wastelands in your deck. Is it to play a mana denial strategy? In some cases (combined with Stony Silence) it can be, but against Shops it's almost never correct to do so. And usually when playing a build like this it's not to deploy a mana denial strategy. It's often not even to make a tempo play but to hit critical lands; I usually see Wastelands as additional Strip Mines which many decks play as a one-of to hit an important land like Bazaar of Baghdad, Karakas, Tolarian Academy, Library of Alexandria or Cavern of Souls.
For what's it's worth, I wouldn't have Wasted in either scenario (and I 100% agree with BrassMan to let Thorn resolve in scenario 1).
I look at lists like this and just wonder if JacoDrazi isn't just better and possibly the same cost. But that is not why you are asking for help....
I think that mental Misstep, dryad militant, and Thorn of Amethyst should be considered. These cards are possible on turn one. point being is you NEED a turn one play. Dryad militant turns off Baby Jace, Snapcaster, cabal therapies, dread returns, and delve spells relatively well. Your biggest fear with this deck is Mentor and STPs (and maybe Oath.) MM helps against one of those. Mentor is just going to steam roll the deck. You have no way to come back from an early Mentor other than your STPs.
The other problem with a deck like this is that it is an anti-meta deck. What decks do you play against in your area or online? You can tune this deck to have an edge against Shops by playing maindeck Kataki and Null Rod. Against blue decks I would have 4 spirit of the labyrinths and 4 Thalia 1.0.
Been running this guy in a control-ish Mentor shell in the tournament practice room on MODO to rather good success (meaning at least slightly more wins than losses). Posting the decklist here for tips from more experienced players. Initially the list was more "passive" than "active" but it has gradually moved into a hybrid between aggro and control. Baral has been good, sometimes great. The cost reduction is good when "going off" with demonic tutor (cc =1 with Baral) or Tinker (cc = 2) or Yawgmoth's will (cc = 2). Looting is nice during normal turns but one needs to be careful to not loot without thinking through if you want to risk losing good cards in hand. Baral is obviously great against Thorn-effects, that's where he really shines. But anyways, on to the decklist:
3 Baral, Chief of Compliance
4 Force of Will
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Swords to Plowshares
3 Monastery Mentor
2 Dack Fayden
2 Mana Drain
3 Mental Misstep
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Treasure Cruise
1 Dig Through Time
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Black Lotus
1 Library of Alexandria
4 Flooded Strand
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Volcanic Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Mox Jet
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Polluted Delta
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Mindbreak Trap
Sooo i have been testing this as a one of in a U/B key/vault outcome list. Its a pretty far break from the conventional lists i see people playing these days, but i think the card can have a place in many combo control lists. I had a chance to test it at a local event and went undefeated in the Swiss. As for Whir itself, the card won me the game outright 3 times on the day and pitched to force a few more (which i think is a pretty good track record for a one of at a small tourney). I can say the card is at least solid but i cant help feeling that there arnt better cards to be playing. I enjoyed the utility of Whir and am playing many one-of artifacts in the main and SB to take advantage of this. I would say if u r playing transmute artifact it is a strict upgrade, so there's that. Just my thoughts :)
Having a Vintage gauntlet is super fun! I have one and I think that Elliot B. in the bay area has one that he printed out a while back. I usually have between 12 and 18 Vintage decks built out at any time (with a metric shit-ton of proxies) to test with friends. Thanks to the VSL, a lot of people are familiar with some of the notable vintage decks, so a lot of people can pick up a deck and at least make reasonable plays after a few games and get super excited to be playing Magic's most awesome format. When I was building my gauntlet (and when I decide to change it), I basically followed the advice that Steven gave you above. I think that my current gauntlet includes:
2 Mentor Decks (a stock list and my dumb combo mentor deck)
Land Heavy Dredge
A more Fenton-esque build of Oath
DPS (Haven't got around to building Paradoxical Storm)
A UW Moat Control Brew Deck
My stupid Thing in the Ice/Blood Moon deck
Why these decks? Some are good and some are fun. Depending on your mood and purpose, you'll want to play with different ones. Have fun learning this crazy ass format!
I have also listened the MUD's player reasoning. Also from another perspective: there is always that person at a tournament that quickly loses chances because he was paired against a weird deck in first round and quickly lost chances to perform Top8. That was really usual years ago when there were lots of budget decks around playing 4 null rods: combo or blue players could be prepared against Tier 1 decks, but then suffer against rogue decks. However MUD is quite strong against most "rogue" decks, being a great deck to start winning rounds.
I also understand the gush player reasoning. Once you assume you have a deck capable of having a >50% wins, and capable of win rogue decks, you can focus on Tier 1 decks. Since gush decks are really Tier 1, focusing on the mirror totally makes sense.
In my case, I don't design my deck to maximize chances of winning random decks. I just try to pack some cards that I'm confortable with, bearing in mind tier decks. Since I don't play a tier deck, I never had to play a mirror (after about 40-50 rounds of tournament and dozens of matches in cockatrice), so I don't think at it at all.
Disabled Categories are greyed out
This topic will be moved to the category
Looks like your connection to The Mana Drain was lost, please wait while we try to reconnect.