I normally avoid topics like this as it makes little sense to me to speculate on cards WotC hasn't and likely will never print. That said, I have a question for the OP, @dshin: do you believe that printing overpowered, difficult to interact with hate cards for certain strategies leads to more interesting gameplay? Because I don't believe that. It turns MTG into the card game War with better artwork
I agree with you 100%, and I proposed the card I did as a reflection of that principle. I think hate cards should require skill to use, and that there should be good, interesting ways to interact against them. I honestly can't think of many hate cards that exist currently that beat my proposal when judged by these measures.
To illustrate some of the potential decision making - do you tap out to cast your Jace the Mind Sculptor, or do you wait for another mana source to keep your Hate Island live? Do you tap it to play your opponent's Gitaxian Probe when he also has a Mental Misstep in his graveyard, or do you permanently keep it up for that Misstep? As the opponent, if you have Mental Misstep in your graveyard, every one mana spell you cast represents a potential bluff, as Hate Island can only be used once per turn. That's a ton of nontrivial decision points that get created for both players, and the more nontrivial decision points that get created, the less War-like your game becomes. With delve cards or Snapcaster Mage in hand the decisions become even more complex.
By contrast, cards like Grafdigger's Cage, Rest in Peace, or Trinisphere offer no interaction - those are the types of cards that make Magic more like War.
I wonder if you agree with my overriding principle - that printing a strategically-rich hate card that makes it risky to run the blue cards that people are asking to be restricted might improve the metagame and gameplay. Again, not to beat a dead horse, but I think in the past Time Vault and Tinker were real problems - it didn't make any sense for any blue deck not to run them; this had a homogenizing effect on the metagame and made for uninteresting game play. This problem got fixed because those cards ceased to be as effective. And the reason was because of new card printings.
Does any one know if there could be some copyright trouble if i publish online those old Duellist numbers (partial or whole) ? I do not plan to do any money or whatever with them, just to make them available to the comunauty.
Duelist is still under copyright by WotC. If you're doing something other than just dumping the articles (eg, writing a commentary about the article), you may fall under fair use. Either way, there's bunches of scans of Duelist available online, indicating that it's unlikely you'll get hit with a copyright complaint.
It's nice to hear positive things come out of this community. Deep down at the end of the day, when we're all done slinging mud both literally and figuratively at eachother, it's nice to see people still care.
Thank you, everyone. This deck is a great entry point for Dredge players into Old School, as it is probably the closest analogue, especially the Deep Spawn "dredge engine." So I can see why @Lesbimagical enjoyed this :)
Mind Bomb is a legitimate consideration, but suffers the same problem as Breakthrough in Vintage Dredge. You need a steady and iterative engine to go big with Ashen Ghouls. In many matchups, all you are trying to do is get 3-4 Ashen Ghouls into play, uncounterable.
Demonic Consultation is a really good card, but it was unrestricted until 2000. If you restrict Consult, it would certainly make this deck less consistent, but I still think it could be viable. I think the jury is out on whether Consult would need to be restricted in 95 Old School.
@mickey.nobilis Number of players is not an indication of competitiveness though. EDH people always got extremely offended when I played a Vintagesque broken combo deck against them. Your standard FNM's are mostly bad players with incomplete decks too, and standard FNM is probably the most popular format out there.
The merits of allowed sets isn't a big deal for me. I have cards that would allow me to play EC rules, but so far I prefer playing Swedish. I thought it would be more interesting to talk about the aesthetics of the format. I'm relieving my teenage years playing old school, which to me is precisely what type 1 should be. I love the old cards; I love making all black bordered decks. I love 'snobbing' up and only playing unlimited white borders. I grew up on 4th and Ice Age, but right now I can only stomach cards from 1993-1994. I've even picked up the 1994 Duelists to relive the 'magic' of the era (no pun intended). I'm enjoying saving up for cards, just like when I was a kid. I can't build the best decks, so I make do with the best I've got.
Hmm, I also just noticed that I can't spell the word 'thread' in my opening post. I was on heavy Mucinex yesterday...
It takes money to get Hearthstone cards; I know people who have spent several hundred dollars and I probably spent about $100 myself. There is no way to get the cards you want directly either and no redemption or way of regaining money for your Hearthstone cards.
In other words, if the game is good, people will pay to play. But probably we all love Vintage more than the average magic player loves magic.
I lost my favorite non-Vintage format to a non-DCI entity's whim. 5-Color was a great format, based on the deck construction rules of deck minimums of 250 cards and color minimums of 20 cards (one card = one color, Fire/Ice was the best blue card in red-focused decks and red card in blue-focused decks). Then one day the website's owner decided to up the count to 300 because he didn't like the Wisconsin metagame, which was entirely different from the Philadelphia one. This broke the format into two pieces, and both metagames died within a year.
I won't play non-DCI formats again. Commander and Old School are both fractured like 5-Color's dying breath, with regional ban lists and unrealistic metagame expectations from non-DCI legislative bodies. If Vintage loses DCI oversight than they lose my playership.
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