[AKH] Gideon of the Trials
So my 16 year old daughter who has only ever done limited events (3 pre-releases and FNM drafts the past 10 months) just texted me the following: New card I think:? I don't know if this one already exists or not. But either way, what were they thinking with this?!
At 3 mana I think this is very playable in vintage and in the right shell I think its a fantastic control piece.
People are claiming an army of monk tokens make this a pushover. But when he's barricaded in his castle walls behind a Moat, that army of monk tokens is pretty useless. As @vaughnbros said, this is great in a u/w landstill shell.
MaximumCDawg last edited by
Its worse than Arcane Lab at stopping the Storm, but he does shut down Blightsteel.
He also provides a fairly fast clock, and is main deckable due to his applications against other decks.
Yeah this is all he does. He stops decks that want to kill you with Storm or with a single, really big threat while being a 4/4 for 3 on the attack. That's pretty decent. Good card.
You can combo him with moat and, he can beat anything in the metagame.
If you have a moat in play and it's stopping your opponent's creatures, then why do you even need Gideon?
Even against the creature decks, he makes it very hard to kill you as they need at least 2 threats on the board to even hurt him. Setting him up with a Baby Jace, and now you have double fog effects. Your opponent has to establish a pretty large army to take down your Walkers setting you up for a blowout Wrath effect.
I guess? Every creature and Walker is potentially a "fog" effect, though, and we've got a lot of competition in white that fogs as well or better than a 3 loyalty walker.
Seems like an auto include in the @ChubbyRain Nahiri-Emrakul deck.
vaughnbros last edited by
@MaximumCDawg You can't beat me with creatures (Moat), and you can't beat me with spells/effects (Giddeon). How does your opponent beat you?
@vaughnbros Speaking specifically about Storm, Chain of Vapor on your Gideon gets the job done. Obviously there is strictly no way to win while both of those permanents remain in play, but that's not a given in any situation.
vaughnbros last edited by
@revengeanceful Right, but they have to have a spell that specifically removes one of them.
mediumsteve last edited by
It probably goes in some of the UW durdle decks, but those decks aren't very good in the first place right now. Probably not going to shake things up very much. This is just a speed bump for the decks it's trying to beat.
the_unseen last edited by
While in planeswalker form you would need a bounce spell to deal with him, but if used to attack (in his 4/4 human soldier form) he becomes vulnerable also to swords, path, or any exile spell.
Chase_Dagger last edited by
Too bad Final Fortune, Last Chance, and Pact of Negation are still unplayable with this guy. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Protoaddict last edited by
In the scenario where you are playing with him in a moat build, I almost think you would use him for just the Emblem and then drop the gideon who can +1 for additional loyalty equal to the creatures your opponent had, then next turn nuke their board. Just a thought anyway.
Brass Man last edited by
For the way most decks are built now, if you have Moat+Gideon, and they have an answer to Moat, the Gideon probably doesn't help - it's trivially easy for most decks to kill the Gideon by attacking once the Moat is destroyed
If they DON'T have an answer to Moat, than you probably win without Gideon at all.
If you already have a Moat out:
- Eldrazi has no way of killing you without removing it, so Gideon is irrelevant.
- Shops plans on killing you with Ballista/Ravager, so Gideon is irrelevant.
- Saheeli Oath decks have to remove the Moat anyway, so Gideon is irrelevant
- Griselbrand Oath decks with Vault/Key, and Omni-Oath decks with Emrakul don't really care about Moat OR Gideon
- Dredge decks generally have to kill the Moat, making Gideon irrelevant, or win with Marit Lage, which Gideon can't stop (if timed correctly).
- The exception with Dredge is if the Dredge pilot plans on winning through Moat with a Dread-Return'ed Kolaghan, in which case Gideon actually would matter - but only if it has 6 counters on it, meaning it's been in play for 7 turns, which is not super exciting or likely.
- Mentor/Gush decks facing down a Moat might try to beat it with a Jace ultimate, which, unlike every other scenario, the Gideon actually would stop ... but ... if you actually get hit by a Jace ultimate (either one), it means you have no library, and therefore have lost your ability to threaten or interact with your opponent. That means if they have a single answer to Moat anywhere in their deck, they will draw it, and they will resolve it, and they have limitless uninterrupted turns until they do
Basically the situations in which Gideon makes a Moat better are pretty rare - far less than the number of situations where a Swords to Plowshares or a Red Elemental Blast or a Mana Drain make your Moat better. Consider that those all of those cards are unrestricted, and Moat isn't particularly winning a lot right now.
Winterstar last edited by
And if you are at -6 life and something happens to your Gideon, you still lose.
Brassy covered everything else- just pointing out that a lot of people seem to approach this from the "you have to do something about Gideon first."
oes. He stops decks that want to kill you with Storm or with a single, really big threat while being a 4/4 for 3 on the attack. That's pretty decent. Good card.
Don't Planeswalkers that don't win games with any abilities need not apply? Not losing is not good enough period.