[HOD]Abrade


  • TMD Supporter

    I think this card suffers the same problems as Izzet Charm. It does multiple things that are useful but it doesn't do any one thing very well.

    The only instance when I could think of a card like this being played is Rakdos Charm or Steel Sabotage. And even then, they're basically on the outside looking in as far as Vintage goes. At least SS is blue and costs one mana. Rakdos Charm is pretty bad; if it costed one It would be better. Bu 1R is unplayable.


  • TMD Supporter

    @Saya

    I meant that it can deal with two different issues at once in the same time. Which means that these can be 2 different types of approaches/cards, not that the 2 effects were simultaneous.



  • @desolutionist I would tend to agree with your comparison except that 1R is actually something people do play for both modes already: By Force or the now obsolete Wear//Tear and Sudden Shock. A lot of the time Abrade is the same as Abrupt Decay.

    Now, all the cards I just mentioned are pretty medium in Vintage, but people keep playing them. Basically it belongs in the By Force, Sudden Shock, Abrupt Decay category of whatever, not the Izzet Charm, Rakdos Charm, Unsubstantiate circle of hell. And lots of people, yourself included, somehow thought Unsubstantiate was playable.

    Simultaneously culling a dead draw from your Mentor and PO matchups has actual value.



  • Yeah... I like this card and am sure it will see some play. But I think even Fire//Ice is probably better right now, as well as many of the other cards that just got mentioned.



  • Kills chalice and monastery mentor, this card is 100% vintage playable.


  • TMD Supporter

    @wappla

    I don't think By Force, Abrupt Decay, or Sudden Shock are good cards either. Maybe playable, but definitely not good. When I strive to play a deck with 'good' cards, this one doesn't jump out to me. Like, what would I cut for this? A Hurkyl's Recall? A Toxic Deluge? Then I'm going to be in a situation where my sideboard cards can't even do what I need them for.

    Against Shops, is 1-for-1ing a two-thirds mana spell with a 2 mana spell a good trade? What happens when you add Spheres into the mix.

    Against Mentor, if they resolved Mentor, you already lost. What's an Incinerate going to do? Maybe you take a 1-for-1 trade if they're in topdeck mode, but that just doesn't strike me as winning. Not many decks try to remove Mentor directly and get away with it; usually if anything they play Sulfur Elemental. Like no one is going to say oh look a Mentor deck, time to bring in Abrade!

    Some marginal use against hate bears at the expense of what? Toxic Deluge/Pyroclasm/Firespout?

    Anything can be 'playable' in Vintage but I'd be very surprised to see this card 'winning'



  • Yea this card doesnt look good to me at all. Its not a bolt or incinerate, it cannot hit players or planeswalkers. If it let you do BOTH options, and hit players, great card, as is, IMO, garbage.



  • Isn't this the dream sideboard card vs. Eldrazi? It's very difficult to sideboard against them because hitting only artifacts isn't enough and hitting only creatures isn't enough, but the best removal cards in vintage (fragmentize, grudge, chewer, swords) only hit one or the other. This kills everything in their deck except TKS and Smasher.



  • @boggyb said in [HOD]Abrade:

    Isn't this the dream sideboard card vs. Eldrazi? It's very difficult to sideboard against them because hitting only artifacts isn't enough and hitting only creatures isn't enough, but the best removal cards in vintage (fragmentize, grudge, chewer, swords) only hit one or the other. This kills everything in their deck except TKS and Smasher.

    This doesn't do enough damage for eldrazi. Artifact removal can take care revokers and yes this can get rid of displacers. Those are annoying. But this card still does nothing against TKS or Smahers unless you sacrifice another card, like a creature to block. You could potentially use this instead of single-target artifact removal. But you still need slots for STP's.



  • @Khahan It also hits Thalias and Wingmare. And every single other card in their deck except TKS and Smasher.

    On the play vs Eldrazi, which would you rather have?

    1. Fetch, Fetch, Mox, Abrade
    2. Fetch, Fetch, Mox, Ancient Grudge

    Think about it. Your grudge might hit two of their artifacts, but it's more likely they'll have 0 artifacts and 2 creatures, or 1 of each. In this case, I'd rather have the one Abrade.

    Agreed you still need STP but I think there's a strong case to be made that this is better than Grudge against Eldrazi, and it's more maindeckable, as it hits JVP, as well as Mentor about half the time, not to mention scads of random dorks.



  • @boggyb said in [HOD]Abrade:

    @Khahan It also hits Thalias and Wingmare. And every single other card in their deck except TKS and Smasher.

    On the play vs Eldrazi, which would you rather have?

    1. Fetch, Fetch, Mox, Abrade
    2. Fetch, Fetch, Mox, Ancient Grudge

    Think about it. Your grudge might hit two of their artifacts, but it's more likely they'll have 0 artifacts and 2 creatures, or 1 of each. In this case, I'd rather have the one Abrade.

    Agreed you still need STP but I think there's a strong case to be made that this is better than Grudge against Eldrazi, and it's more maindeckable, as it hits JVP, as well as Mentor about half the time, not to mention scads of random dorks.

    that's why I said you would use this instead of single-target artifact removal. We seem to have the same thoughts. I just wouldn't call it 'the dream sideboard' card you did. A dream sideboard card would at least also take out TKS.


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