@hierarchnoble said in EW Meta and discussion.:

@supertimland said in EW Meta and discussion.:

@hierarchnoble First time I've seen Gummi Bears discussed in a mtg commentary.

It was the second for me. Then again, I was responsible for the first too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-un-LzGVIQ

I need to find a 'schtick'. Maybe like, taking a swig of whiskey from a flask then offering my opponent.... idk.

I was on almost the same paradoxical list as last year. its running 3 chain of vapor main and no misstep. I got rolled by a kambal in the first match, then beat shops twice, beat dredge, lost to pyromancer in round 5. Round 6 I won against a deck I think was shops but I went off t1 in game 1 and the poor guy mulled to 4 game 2. I got to see his beautiful alpha lotus and that was about it. Round 7 opponent had trinisphere t1 on the play game 1. I won game 2 and he had trinisphere t1 game 3 (again!) which I forced. He then dumped lotus, null rod still in t1 game 3. Unfortunately I pitched a chain of vapor to the FOW and kept my time walk (because I had planned to tinker for a blightsteel with FOW backup but it cost me the game).
Next year I need to take it a little easier at old school. I played a very good player round 1 and I was just trying not to puke on him.
Saturday I was playing old school in the hall and Joe Brennan walked up and remembered my name from our feature match last year and commented that it was a great match. Class act.
I don't think the sky is falling with the top 8 representation. I'd look at the names and not the decks.

@bobbyvictory I can't read sarcasm on the internet, but in case you're being serious, attendance was up by 70 players from last year, and it was the 2nd largest Champs of all time. If your subjective experience of the format is bad right now, that sucks and I feel for you ... but making up numbers and stating opinions as facts doesn't make your case more compelling if you're hoping for change.

@brass-man
Attendance was down this year from the last time EW was in PA(2015). It's not fair to compare it to last years EW that was in Ohio. Ohio lost over 100 players from 2015.

2015 PA attendance #s-460 vintage players (count taken from wotc site)
2017 PA attendance #s-427 vintage players (count taken from cardtitan site)

That is over a 7% decrease in attendance. These are all facts.

last edited by Guest

@sovarius I did deck checks on the 5ks on Sun, I believe there were 61 or 71 in the vintage and maybe 54 in the legacy. Vintage was 6 rds as was the legacy if I remember correctly.

@bobbyvictory Idk what the numbers were for legacy last year, but there were 711 in the main event this year and I know that side events attendance was up significantly (having worked them 3 of 4 days). I'm pretty sure all of the vintage side events were very well attended as well.

@colbey81 I posted the official count in my reply to Brassman above. Legacy is doing well, I agree. Vintage is declining though.

last edited by Guest

@bobbyvictory and Pittsburgh, PA is physically closer to Columbus, Ohio than it is to Philadelphia, PA. I feel like you're cherry-picking your data points here.

2008 (Indianapolis) - "over 100 players"
2009 (Indianapolis) -
2010 (US Nats ?? ) - 117 players
2011 (??) - ??
2012 (??) - 186 players
2013 (Philadelphia) - 232 players
2014 (Philadelphia) - 341 players
2015 (Philadelphia) - 460 players
2016 (Columbus) - 350 players
2017 (Pittsburgh) - 429 players

I can't find numbers for years prior, but I remember them being around 100 from back to 2003.

When looking at all the numbers together, I could use this very same data to argue something like ...
Vintage was largely stagnant until 2010 when Lodestone Golem was printed, after which it exploded in popularity. In 2016 Lodestone was restricted and attendance dropped massively. Over the next year workshops began to get good again, and so attendance went up. If we had some way of mapping "how good shops is in the meta" vs "champs attendance" I bet you'd see a similar curve.

Of course, I don't think there's a causal relationship there at all ... I just think humans are really good at looking at data and finding a narrative that fits the opinion they had before they started looking at it.

@bobbyvictory said in EW Meta and discussion.:

@brass-man
Attendance was down this year from the last time EW was in PA(2015). It's not fair to compare it to last years EW that was in Ohio. Ohio lost over 100 players from 2015.

2015 PA attendance #s-460 vintage players (count taken from wotc site)
2017 PA attendance #s-427 vintage players (count taken from cardtitan site)

That is over a 7% decrease in attendance. These are all facts.

I am confused, a 7% decrease invokes panic from you? Wasn't 2015 in August and 2017 in October? Kids are back in school and what not, different time of the year some people may not have been able to attend. I don't think that's significant in any way at all.

@oneofchaos kids don't play vintage, i think that argument does not apply here.

@bobbyvictory said in EW Meta and discussion.:

@oneofchaos kids don't play vintage, i think that argument does not apply here.

People who play vintage have kids...

@oneofchaos It's not hard to find a sitter(family member or close friend) or send them to sleep over with a friend if the kids are teens. We both know MTG players will go through these types of measures to play.

@bobbyvictory said in EW Meta and discussion.:

@oneofchaos It's not hard to find a sitter(family member or close friend) or send them to sleep over with a friend if the kids are teens. We both know MTG players will go through these types of measures to play.

You are right, it's definitely not hard. For those that CANT find a sitter, lets choose a small number, say SEVEN PERCENT might not be able to make the event. Use your head man, it's a summer event vs a fall event. People take the most vacation in December/Summer.

@oneofchaos If someone only wanted to play in the vintage portion of the event, they would only need 2 vacation days tops. 1 if they drove/fly out after work on thursday. I don't see that being a huge factor as people play hooky all the time.

@hierarchnoble said in EW Meta and discussion.:

This event was great! I really enjoyed the chance to commentate with Randy Buehler for the first time, as well as spending time goofing around with my buddy Mark Hornung. There were a lot of huge shakeups in the final round that left the top 8 as it was, including the two 7-1-1s both getting paired down and both losing, allowing Eric to sneak into 8th seed at 8-2. I don't have access to the standings right now, but that last slot could have been any number of players, including @13NoVa, as it didn't look clear until the round settled. I was very happy with the games that I got to commentate, and hopefully my love of the format translated well over Twitch. Thank you everyone that said nice things to me and for everyone that I got to talk to, either for the first time or for the first time in a while. Please let me know if you have any feedback for me. I'm going to try to run it back next year and the audience deserves the best possible show.

I had some people from my personal (ie non-Magic) life watching twitch that day to see my matches and it was volunteered that the commentators this year were outstanding.

last edited by brianpk80

@bobbyvictory said in EW Meta and discussion.:

@oneofchaos If someone only wanted to play in the vintage portion of the event, they would only need 2 vacation days tops. 1 if they drove/fly out after work on thursday. I don't see that being a huge factor as people play hooky all the time.

It seems like you are looking at this as people literally will do anything possible to play vintage, when in reality people have lives. The event in 2015 being a summer event vs 2017 being a fall event definitely is relevant. Also regardless of whether or not people CAN make the event, sometimes a son's football game might merit more meaning than playing vintage. Also think about it - if I have a family and want to play vintage and it's in the summer, my wife can take the kids to the zoo or something while I play in the summer. During the school year I'm not pulling the kids out of school.

@brianpk80 Definitely the best year of commentating to date. They educated viewers, had a good sense of humor and were professional. I hope we get to see deck techs on stream like SCG streams in years to come.

last edited by Guest
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