@jimtosetti Is Preordain #3 better than a Ponder? Where are you on Mission Briefing after a few leagues? Thoughts on Spell Piece to combat PWs and adding more grudges main?

@pugsuperstar said in Oath:

@jimtosetti Is Preordain #3 better than a Ponder? Where are you on Mission Briefing after a few leagues? Thoughts on Spell Piece to combat PWs and adding more grudges main?

Ponder can be good provided you get some sequence of cards that can be effective in that particular game. It can be a gamble in the early game because you might not know what you need to win yet. Preordain is consistent at finding lands and the Oath of Druids. Ponder is better in decks that use more fetch lands because you can shuffle the extra cards away. Ponder is also better in more dedicated combo decks.

As far as Mission Briefing and a few leagues goes, its more like Mission Briefing after hundreds of leagues. Mission Briefing has a similar function to Yawgmoth's Will. It is harder to cast when there are more sphere effects in the meta.

I started to test Daze to combat Planeswalkers and counter magic, but my experience is that you still lose to turn one Karn when they are on the play. I have some ideas to test when we can use the Modern Horizons cards the might help Oath in tough situations.

Ancient Grudge is very good against artifact based decks and very poor against Xerox decks. You can probably go two ways with the deck. A general strategy for all matches game one, or a main deck that is focused towards particular matches that sides into the other matches in a strong way. However, players have been successful in relevant numbers using multiple main deck Ancient Grudges.

My experience with Spell Pierce has never been good with this deck, but that was when Xerox was a major competitor. I've thought about trying out one Spell Pierce, so maybe I will try it tonight.

I know that myself and many other people are becoming very unenthused with losing to turn one Karn. At this point it highly probably we are making donations to WOTC when we join leagues.

If I figure out anything significant with the Modern Horizons cards I will post the deck lists and card discussion here. My theory with Magic is to test anything that enters you mind as a good idea. You will never find out if they are good ideas if you never test them. My Twitch account name is the same as here, jimtosetti. I play Oath fairly often. Feel free to come deck build with us there. I'm on most days starting anywhere from 5pm -7pm central time.

last edited by Guest

How are you guys building oath now with misstep restricted and how is it doing overall in the meta?

Less cages to worry about if dredge is no longer everywhere right?

I'm unsure, i have a generic control pile of the regular restricted draw spells and stuff. Playing 1x Griselbrand, 1x Niv Mizzet Parun, and 1x Sphinx of the Steel Wind/1x Tinker.

I've seen Wrenn and Six show up but i'm not sure how great that could be - haven't tried it.

Looking at mtgop8, i do see less cages i think. Just in shops right now, it appears.

I've picked up a set of Force of Vigors to combat the Mystic Forge Karn Lattice bs, but i never got around to putting them into the deck before they were restricted. Now i'm wondering if a couple would still be good, however i don't know what the green count would have to look like.

But i'm down to shop. I started a side gig buying/selling cards and i haven't had so much time to just aimlessly look at vintage content for 6 hours a week, so i've decided i'm just playing Oath no matter what at EW. I'm so unsure of the new shaping up right now.

So what are you using instead of 3 misstep now then? 🙂

An extra Pyroblast, Nature's Claim, and a Lightning Bolt. Although Bolt may be sketch, but i figured it pops planeswalkers at a similar rate as Pyro, pops all of Shops creatures at about the same rate as Nature's Claim, as well as Arcanist, Leo, Confidant, C Priest, and Lavinia.

But i also haven't started with any 'stock' list so saying those replaced my missteps probably does not mean that much.

New events posted up on MTGTop 8 gives me some insight to how much i'd like to have Nature's Claim in the main, which is very little in this meta. Shops has declined some.

I thought Abrade could make a comeback for me. I've been trying it but i'm just wondering if i should try playing a Veil of Summer main or something else with a little bit of spice. I'm never happy with it really but it's such a good card.

Spell Pierce, is it fine in Oath? We don't mind going for a long game if we keep the opponent's threats down, but the longer it goes the more likely an opponent can have 2 mana. Miser Mana Drain fine?

3 Pyro in the main is too much or just fine? It doesn't seem too too excessive, but maybe the 4th in the SB is? Jeskai is generally playing 2 or 3, seems to a bit over half the lists are on 3. A recent Oath deck in the league on the 15th took 2nd and was straight up playing 4 in the main (they were also playing 3 abrade and 4 narset)

What's the role of Gush nowadays? I see no one playing it, but i feel like it used to be.

What's the role of black to play DT and Vamp and Will? This is another thing i've seen people come off of to a degree, from the last 2 months about half of the Oath decks were including black still but i've seen a RUG oriented approach.

16 Lands and 5 mana rocks? I had 17 lands and it was definitely causing flood.

My singleton Mana Confluence? I essentially have this instead of a basic Island since i'm playing 4 colors. The life loss can't exactly be ignored but i've really never been disappointed in drawing it. The larger downside may be the lack of a basic.

I really like lightning bolt, and if anything i'd play 2 in the main before i cut the first. That's not crazy is it? Plus one in the side. It's just so good against a fair amount of creatures and Narset.

I would love to try a misdirection again. Veil of Summer seems a bit like it fills a similar role in countering Decay/Trophy, but Misdirection is free and reverses the removal rather than just counter, or snag opposing Ancestrals. Misdirection also snags Fragmentize unlike Veil.

My list, i don't know how to format.

The Monsters Three:
1x Griselbrand
1x Niv Mizzet Parun
1x Sphinx of the Steel Wind

Lands (16):
4x Forbidden Orchard
1x Library of Alexandria
1x Mana Confluence
2x Flooded Strand
3x Polluted Delta
1x Underground Sea
2x Volcanic Island
2x Tropical Island

More Mana (5):
5x Moxes
1x Lotus

Draw (10):
3x Preordain
1x Ancestral
1x Gush
1x Treasure Cruise
1x Dig Through Time
1x Ponder
1x Brainstorm
1x Gitaxian Probe

Counterspell (10):
4x Force of Will
3x Pyroblast
1x Mental Misstep
1x Flusterstorm
1x Spell Pierce

Removal (2):
1x Lightning Bolt
1x Ancient Grudge

Planeswalkers (4):
2x Dack Fayden
2x Narset, Parter of Veils

Oaths, Tutors, and other Vintage (9):
4x Oath of Druids
1x Tinker
1x Time Walk
1x Vampiric Tutor
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Yawgmoth's Will

Any thoughts or recommendations are appreciated!

@aeonsovarius What do you think about Blightsteel over Sphinx for a Tinker target? If memory serves (last time I actually played with Tinker) the choice here is pretty metagame dependent, but just wondering if you'd considered it.

I've played in Oath, Paradoxical Oath, and builds of Oath and Paradoxical that transform. It's a great card! And you know what, there's kind of less Dack Fayden right now so it could be really good. They dodge virtually the same amount of removal, too. I like the lifegain though, and not dying on crackback to dude decks (shops and survival). Maye it could make a comeback, but on the other hand i've cast Sphinx a few times in the last couple dozen games.

Well, in addition to Oko being great in Oath to blank Priest and Cage, as well as forcing them to have a dude, i think Sphinx is better than Blightsteel now more than ever in Tinker builds due to dodging opponent Okos.

Anyone share a list with me? 🙂

I think Miharu winning that event drastically changed the landscape of Vintage Champs. I swear its like 20% Oath over here right now!

I haven't had time to play much Vintage lately, but my understanding was that it was a dark time for Oath these days due to the Force of Vigor infestation of the format. Is this not actually an issue?

@evouga Force of Vigor, meet Force of Will. Oath = gg.

Anyone have some tips on how to deal with Karakas?

@wakkz Sorcerous Spyglass, Strip Mine. Elks, maybe.

last edited by Yugi Mutou

@wakkz Spyglass is amazing utility vs lands. It works vs Maze as well in some matches. Strip/Waste is your best utility vs bad-for-you lands.

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