Life from the Loam in Dredge

  • @vaughnbros This is my current decklist:

    Creature (22)
    4x Bloodghast
    4x Golgari Grave-Troll
    2x Ichorid
    4x Narcomoeba
    4x Prized Amalgam
    4x Stinkweed Imp

    Instant (10)
    4x Force of Will
    4x Mental Misstep
    3x Mindbreak Trap

    Land (12)
    4x Bazaar of Baghdad
    2x Dakmor Salvage
    2x Mana Confluence
    2x Petrified Field

    Sorcery (10)
    4x Cabal Therapy
    4x Creeping Chill
    1x Undiscovered Paradise

    Enchantment (2)
    4x Bridge from Below

    Artifact (4)
    4x Serum Powder

    Sideboard (15)
    3x Abrupt Decay
    4x Hollow One
    2x Mana Confluence
    4x Nature's Claim
    2x Petrified Field

    I was thinking of removing 2 Bridge for 2 Loam, 1 Paradise and a MD Field for 2 Portals, a Mindbreak trap for a Barbarian Ring, and 1 SB Paradise for a Barbarian Ring.

  • @davidlemon said in Life from the Loam in Dredge:

    Always felt like I needed to maximize game 1 since games 2 and 3 can be so tough.

    while this feeling is understandable, in many game 1s your deck could contain literal ham sandwiches and, provided you correctly noted the lunchmeats on your decklist, you would still very much be the favorite. so there's a lot of space in the average dredge list, I might say 16 cards or so and Lance might say 30, in terms of what you can have maindeck and still win game 1 due to the mechanical superiority of the deck. it's possible you're trading percentages, but going down 5% in game 1s to be up 10% in each postboard game, to make up numbers, would certainly be worth it.

  • @blindtherapy

    To elaborate more on that, there is a limit to how good your game 1 % can even be. You are never really going to overcome the Mulligan to oblivion %'s. You also need to win at least one game 2/3 in every match. You don't actually even need to win game 1 (which is something that other decks use to take advantage of Dredge).

    EDIT: Expanding a little bit more:
    Where, x=game 1 win% and y=game 2/3 win% then to be favored we have:
    Which simplifies to: -2 x y^2 + 2 x y + y^2>0.5
    If we take the formula from the bottom where 1/2 < x < 1, we get the following resulting table.

    So no matter how good your game 1 win % is, you still need to get to above 30% in game 2/3 to be favored in the match.


    Those seem like fine changes, but just something small is that I think you probably want Cabal Pit over Barbarian Rings, especially if you are sticking with Abrupt Decays.

  • @vaughnbros I was wondering your reasoning as to why you would recommend Cabal Pit over Barbarian Ring. I see no benefit to Cabal Pit, as Barbarian Ring is much more versatile because it can hit PW and my opponent. Is there something I am missing?

  • @rat3de

    It taps for black mana, and is activated with black mana.

  • @vaughnbros In your experience has the gain in consistency from it offset the loss of versatility?

  • @rat3de Yes. I don't think its an overly common situation where the 2 damage to a player is that relevant.

  • @vaughnbros What are your thoughts on it with Creeping Chill? That was the main reason I was considering it over Cabal Pit, as I thought if my creatures were locked in GY due to a hate card I could just recur it for a few turns to kill them. Also what about a 1-1 split between the two?

  • @rat3de

    Your only way of producing red mana in this deck is to hurt yourself so I'm not sure about that. Creeping Chill is a build around card, imo, I think it might be out of place here. But if you like it then go for it.

  • @vaughnbros Thank you for your help.