alt text

5RR
Creature - Dragon
This spell costs 1 less to cast for each land card in your graveyard.
Flying, haste
4/4

Is this the kind of answer to PWs we can play? I don't know if a hasty creature is better than, say, The Elderspell or whatever. RR seems easier to pay than BB though. Another problem is that this doesn't kill Karn if the +1 first (but makes them lose it if the -2 the next turn). It's also highly improbable you'd play this turn 2 (you'd need fetch + Dack turn 1 to do this I guess), but it's an easy turn 3/4 play, right?

Also seems easy enough to play against Shops or Eldrazi too and is an able body to block or be on the offense.

It's nice in that it can always reduce down to 2 under spheres if you get enough in the yard, but at the same time its a lot of work to get there.

I really like the design of it though with a lot of the other Lands in the Graveyard matter theme in this set.

@protoaddict yeah, 5 lands is a lot. Good thing is that being Wastelanded is not that much of an issue for this, unless it takes you off the 2nd red mana, of course.

Almost all of these cards that reference a single card type for cost reduction are unplayable.

0_1559058478195_fba9b7bc-4f34-462a-a035-fb773acc6508-image.png

X axis is the number of cards you need in your graveyard for probability Y of this card only costing 2. Orange line is 20 lands, and blue line is 15 lands in your deck.

I think this can be made to usually cost 2RR (possibly with a few deck modifications), which is sort of half a mana cheaper than the direct alternatives (the best 4/4+ creatures with flying and haste either cost 4 with downside or 5 with upside). The question is, is that the best option for getting a hasty creature on the board? If three power is enough you get a lot of things that cost three, and three power ought to be enough to take down a fresh JTMS, Narset, or Karn TGC. It's a bit of an indirect comparison because of the colors but Mantis Rider might solve a lot of problems right now.

last edited by craw_advantage

I think that 3 mana is a fair market price for a 4/4 creature, so I'm not too excited by a 7-mana option that might go down as low as RR in the late-game.

I agree that the "tapping lands in graveyards" mechanic is potentially interesting on the right card, though!

Honestly the difference between 7 mana and 6 mana is huge. I might consider this for draft and in some wonkie vintage land deck if that generic mana was only 4. Honestly even then I think there are better options. But the haste on an evasive body to deal with an abundance of planeswalkers is something to consider. Just not at 7 mana.

You probably need stuff like JVP to make this playable I guess, but I can't think of any other 2-3 mana solution to multiple PWs like this one. Direct removal is cool but this is CA if you manage to kill a PW with it. Maybe I'm forgetting something.

@fsecco

The problem is that this is almost never 2-3 mana, at least not until super late game or in a Dredge deck that is going off.

As someone mentioned earlier, Mantis Rider can answer almost all planeswalkers in this fashion and is always 3 mana. There are other decent haste creatures too.

@vaughnbros yeah yeah, I know. Mantis Rider seems very bad as an answer to PWs tough. I mean, REB/Pyro are the best answers but if Karn gets even more prominent, doing 3 damage to him is not enough (he can still +1 then -2 and survive). So what other 4 power hasters do we have?
Also, I never counted lands in my graveyard to understand how much this would cost, but I think that without Dack or JVP we are always around 2-3 until midgame, right?

Just unrestricted Gush and Dack those lands away. Easy guys easy.

@fsecco said in [MH1] Ore-Scale Guardian:

So what other 4 power hasters do we have?

  • The cheapest evasive one is Hell's Thunder at 1RR. It has a Ball Lightning clause though, which kind of stinks, but it also has Unearth (if you forgot about this weird keyword, it's flashback for creatures basically) for 4R, which potentially lets you take down two PWs with it, albeit for a fairly large total investment.

  • If you can get by without evasion, stuff that sticks around costs 4. Some examples: Savage Knuckleblade (flexible in that it only actually costs 3 with an option to pay one extra for haste), Cliffrunner Behemoth (only gets haste if you have a red permanent but also has five power and sometimes lifelink too), Crocodile of the Crossing (nominally a 5/4, makes you put a -1/-1 counter on one of your creatures so is probably a 4/3, still fulfills the prompt), etc. Basically, these are creatures you've never heard of for a reason.

  • If you do need evasion, the things competing with this at the good-case 4 cmc all have other drawbacks. To me the best one looks like Falkenrath Aristocrat whose drawback is that it's a 4/1, also it's red/black. If trample is good enough, you have stuff like Fleetwheel Cruiser and Giant Solifuge, which both have their own issues.

  • If you can go up to 5cmc (which this card will probably be some of the time but not most of the time), you can get upside stuff like Glorybringer, Demigod of Revenge, Kuldotha Phoenix, etc.

  • Not technically an answer to this question but adjacent to it: Grull Spellbreaker is 3cmc for a 3/3 with trample, conditional hexproof, and riot, which means that it is in effect either a 3/3 haste or a 4/4 regular. So if trample is good enough evasion, you can still pick off the unsuspecting PW that has already been minused or bring it in stronger to get a sustained larger threat.

If you're looking for a hasty creature capable of taking down a planeswalker from high loyalty all by itself, there's also Keldon Champion, which hits for 6 in total on turn one and can stick around. I don't think it's good, but it exists.

@craw_advantage yeah, none of those come close to a 4/4 flyer for RR. The issue is that this is hard to actually play at RR, but the reason I posted it was because it was a 4/4 flyer/haste that stuck into play for 2-3 mana. All those options you gave seem very bad in comparison.
I think the only one that's close is Mantis Rider, but it seems so hard to cast and as I noted before 3 power is not enough to deal with Karn - and if you don't need to deal with Karn then Pyro/REB are just better anyway.

I posted the numbers above on how deep you have to get into your deck for this to be cheap. You are almost never casting this for 2 or 3 on curve. If this is 2 or 3 mana, it’s probably like turn 10. That completely defeats the purpose of its mana cost reduction.

@fsecco said in [MH1] Ore-Scale Guardian:

You probably need stuff like JVP to make this playable I guess, but I can't think of any other 2-3 mana solution to multiple PWs like this one. Direct removal is cool but this is CA if you manage to kill a PW with it. Maybe I'm forgetting something.

The Elderspell just got printed

@gutocmtt you realize I mention Elderspell in my original post, right? Trading 1 for 1 with a PW that just drew a card is not where I want to be though. This kills the PW and leaves a body behind, which is way better if you're paying RR x BB. I agree wihh everyone though that RR is hard to do.

I don’t wanna work this hard for this payoff. All the obvious enablers do more broken stuff.

last edited by ribby
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