@garbageaggro
I’m definitely interested in your list!

@wfain Our friend @chubbyrain took it down. Here is his list
1 Treasure Cruise
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Gitaxian Probe
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Teferi, Time Raveler
1 Narset, Parter of Veils
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Underworld Breach
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Jet
1 Lotus Petal
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Black Lotus
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Spell Pierce
1 Repeal
1 Peek
1 Ponder
1 Brainstorm
1 Daze
1 Dig Through Time
1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Negation
1 Gush
1 Brain Freeze
1 Mental Misstep
1 Lightning Bolt
2 Dack Fayden
3 Pyroblast
4 Force of Will
4 Preordain
1 Monastery Mentor
1 Island
2 Volcanic Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Tundra
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Flooded Strand
Sideboard
1 Yixlid Jailer
1 Containment Priest
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Fragmentize
2 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Hydroblast
1 Infernal Reckoning
1 Leyline of the Void
1 Ravenous Trap
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Wear / Tear
1 Lightning Bolt

last edited by moorebrother1

@moorebrother1 That list is a bit disappointing to me from a builder's perspective. Isn't that basically Jeskai mentor but replacing 2x dreadhordes with a miser copy of underworld breach and brainfreeze for "oops, combo" wins? Breach is likely red yawg-will here and the brainfreeze will just fuel it and delve spells and randomly steal a win off dredge. I'm sure the cards are great here - but doesn't jeskai mentor just win anyway, even if you never see these spells? I was hoping more for a breach list - not an established list just using breach as yawg will.

Lion's Eye Diamond is a Jeskai Mentor card?

The entire thought process behind the deck was to build a xerox style strategy with a powerful combo finish to beat other xerox decks, if I recall chubby's statements correctly. It is notably dipping into black as a 4th color in order to facilitate that, which pretty obviously separates it from normal jeskai mentor.

@smmenen it is now, lol
Seriously though. Lion's eye diamond is obviously a Burning wish Tendrils card.

Would a tinker be worth trying in that list?

I am playing tinker in my list as an additional copy of LED/Lotus and since it is already good there, also a way to grab citadel. Which while it isn't as good as it is in PO is still pretty dang impactful.

@smmenen That's a bit disingenuous. There are only a few cards different here, mainly replacing dreadhorde to get quick burst/combo value in place of long term "double all your 1cmc spells" value. That's like me taking Ravager shops, replacing 3 cards with stonecoil when it was printed and calling it a new deck.

Not dogging the deck. It still looks as powerful as, say, jeskai mentor, but with 3-4 cards changed to add a synergistic combo. I was just saying I was hoping to see a new archetype/deck come out of this card, not just a copy added to an established deck type. This deck is fine for what it is, it's just not what I was hoping this new card would breed - from a builder's pov.

Here's a list I've been tinkering with:

// V_1_Underworld breach

// 61 Maindeck
// 9 Artifact
1 Black Lotus
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Sapphire

// 5 Creature
1 Thassa's Oracle
4 Arclight Phoenix

// 4 Enchantment
4 Underworld Breach

// 20 Instant
1 Mental Misstep
1 Dig Through Time
3 Brain Freeze
1 Chain of Vapor
4 Force of Will
1 Force of Negation
2 Pact of Negation
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Gush
1 Brainstorm
3 Abrade

// 14 Land
4 Volcanic Island
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Island
1 Mystic Sanctuary
1 Tolarian Academy

// 9 Sorcery
1 Treasure Cruise
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Time Walk
1 Ponder
4 Preordain
1 Merchant Scroll

// 1 Planeswalker
1 Narset, Parter of Veils

// 15 Sideboard
// 2 Artifact
SB: 2 Soul-Guide Lantern

// 1 Creature
SB: 1 Inkwell Leviathan

// 4 Enchantment
SB: 4 Leyline of the Void

// 7 Instant
SB: 2 Flusterstorm
SB: 2 Trickbind
SB: 2 Chain of Vapor
SB: 1 Abrade

// 1 Sorcery
SB: 1 Tinker

last edited by Thewhitedragon69

Is Thought Scour better in the 4 Underworld Breach decks than Preordain? I've found that early Underworld Breach seems anemic without enough fuel (both mana and cards in the graveyard).

@yangtime I think the card selection of preordain is just too strong compared to thought scour. You want stuff in your GY, but that's what brain freeze is for. Rather than build a GY over time, you just brain freeze yourself for 12+ and go to town off a breach. Several games get won on chaining things like moxen into preordain into gush into brain freeze for 20ish and swinging with 3-4x phoenix with FoW in hand (or time walk if you have the mana).

Honestly i am still trying to figure out the best version of breach, but tbh i think it wants to run Intuition. It is insanely powerful with breach and makes it easy to set up kills in one card.

@garbageaggro The one thing I've found about breach is that it's vulnerable to all the grave hate that's already around due to dredge. People just board in the grave hate, and it's very tough sledding from there. Unlike dredge, though, you also have to fight through the counterspells to resolve breach, whereas dredge just dodges the stack altogether to win. Also artifact hate and storm hate like thalia, null rod, deafening silence, and ouphe are ALL effective at stopping the breach/lotus/brainfreeze combo. Makes winning with it hard when just about ANY disruptive card hits the combo on some angle.

Sometimes you can just punch through a turn 1 win like PO, but it's much more vulnerable to hate and less resilient. I'll be severely disappointed if the card ends up being a 1-of value engine instead of a 4-of combo. That's using the card as it was intended, and that's just too fair to be great.

I think that is one of the reasons i like intuition, you can shed a lot of the graveyard reliant cards and move into a different plan (tinker, mentor, thassa + consult) and just have enough to keep the main plan available (like 1 copy each of freeze, led [lotus you have anyway], and maybe a couple breach cause it is a fine value card, and like maybe 1 sevinne's reclamation).

If you're already cutting the combo down to the minimum why play not play the xerox style of the deck that has already had decent success? Cutting dead combo pieces like brainfreeze and adding other dead combo pieces like thassa's oracle doesn't seem like an improvement, just an equal change.

I mean that is also a different plan. That would also work in the context i am talking about, but i would play Intuition and Sevinne's Reclamation in that xerox list I think. That is what I am advocating for, not the particular other/main plan.

That makes a lot more sense.

Yeah, I think sevinne's is a solid card to play, especially if you've also got a few 3 mana walkers in the deck. Intuition also seems pretty reasonable reasonable.

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