September 2016 Banned and Restricted List updates



  • There are now only a few weeks before the next round of Banned and Restricted announcements. Out of curiosity, what do people feel warrants restriction/un-restriction/banning/unbanning? Providing data points coupled with the thought process behind it, would be useful for a discussion!

    Please be civil in this thread! It is certain that opinions will differ. People do not need to be convinced that one opinion is better than another; especially when a formal announcement will come out soon enough.

    Personally, I would like to see some cards un-restricted. Providing data around un-restricted cards is quite difficult.

    I would love to see Chalice of the Void un-restricted. Whilst it has not been restricted for long (one year now), one of the main reasons given when it was restricted was to allow for moxen to be played. Over the last year there has been a downturn in the number of moxen being played. Eldrazi decks are able to operate "unpowered". Many creature-based gush decks use only on-colour moxen at most. Prison workshop decks have declined significantly. I am not certain what the impact of adding chalice back into the mix would be, but I would be interested to see.

    The second card that I am interested in having un-restricted is Ponder. There is now a glut of card draw engines and library manipulation cards. Ponder was restricted in June 2008. I am certain that a number of decks would choose to play more than one copy of ponder. The card that would likely be impacted the most would be preordain. I believe that the glut of alternatives and solutions that are now available limit the impact an un-restricted ponder could have.

    The third and final card that I am interested seeing un-restricted is Merchant Scroll. Poor merchant scroll rarely sees play anymore. Dig through time, and treasure cruise may be partially to blame. Unrestricted gush may have contributed. I would like to see more of this card.



  • Merchant Scroll seems like the most likely candidate for un-restriction.



  • @rbartlet I think ponder is just too good to be unrestricted, but that's just me. I would like to see a shops piece unrestricted, but I think it should be golem as opposed to chalice. Chalice is pretty obnoxious, and can go in a few different shells. I like golem because it's a narrower card and I think it is an interesting foil to the eldrazi and hatebear decks; it spheres them and it trades with smashers and such.



  • I'm ok with Merchant Scroll and Ponder. I think Windfall is well past its prime. I'd like to see Imperial Seal unrestricted to teach people how good it is (not many decks play it even if able). Finally, I think Channel would be very cool to unrestrict: either it's trash (possible) or it spawns a new archetype: win-win either way.



  • Merchant Scroll with 4 Gush, 4 FoW, Flusters and Acall and Dig seems too good IMO. Windfall could easily come off. I think Lotus Petal and Fastbond could come off. I would really like Lodestone to come off, in a world without Chalice, Lodestone is just a juggernaut, a single mox and land give you a plethora of answers to it.



  • Merchant Scroll and Ponder can come off only if Gush gets the axe. Fastbond as well, would probably not be a 4-of but unrestricted with gush would probably be too degenerate.



  • In no particular order:

    Unrestricted:

    Lodestone Golem

    I think the original restriction was hasty. I'm curious what this would look like in the meta we have now.

    Ponder

    I've always had a soft spot for this card.

    Merchant Scroll

    Like burning wish, this is probably fine to come off as well.

    The maybe- Chalice of the Void. I know the universal fear is what it can do in a workshop deck. I'm curious what it does in eldrazi tribal and human decks in this environ.



  • Unrestricting Chalice while White Weenie Chalice has unknown degeneracy status is unwise.


  • TMD Supporter

    This post is deleted!


  • Unrestrict Dig through Time



  • @Soly Unrestrict petal and LED and Burning Long becomes teir 1 again. Other than that I fully agree as Gush plus mentor is just too much for any fair deck to overcome.



  • I'd like to see at least one card change restriction status leading up to Eternal Weekend much like WotC used to "shake up" Modern before the Pro Tours that showcased the format.



  • Make America great again #unrestrictchannel #TorchYou2016!



  • @nedleeds #FREECHANNEL



  • @BazaarOfBaghdad said:

    Unrestricting Chalice while White Weenie Chalice has unknown degeneracy status is unwise.

    Eldrazi also would be pretty brutal with 4 x Chalice and insane closing speed. Worse because a unilateral solution like EE is dogshit vs. 4-5 CC 3 turn clocks.

    Lodestone is a far safer unrestrict than Chalice at this point IMHO ... the internet has for the most point adapted and plays creature removal.



  • @GrandpaBelcher said:

    @nedleeds #FREECHANNEL

    How many games would be won by 2-3 Elvish Spirit Guides merrily beating down?



  • @nedleeds Shoulder to shoulder with Chancellor of the Tangle.



  • Chalice is on the "I'd like to see what might happen but fear the result" sort of list.

    Interesting suggestion on the restriction of Probe, Soly. That's certainly one to chew on.



  • Isn't MUD still getting more than 50% of win rate consistently? I don't think that unrestricting golem or chalice is a good idea by any means.

    Merchant, fastbond are bad ideas with gush around.

    Petal seems moderately safe, but allows degenerate plays so my answer is no.

    Channel seemed interesting, but as somebody pointed, a green eldrazi deck would be a problem, not to speak of Emrakul's oath with S&T and 4 channels.

    Windfall and ponder are probably my choices is something has to leave the restricted list. And I'd probably not send anything to that list, but gush removes diversity of blue decks just because it's a terrific draw engine and far beyond that. I like Soly's proposition of restricting Probe, and I'd also restrict Misstep, I don't like the card at all.

    But I expect: no changes



  • Don't touch it this time around



  • It is interesting that the main data cited relates to Workshop decks (being quite successful), and yet discussion is more heavily focused on instants and sorceries. That being said, most of the discussion relates to un-restricting cards, which feels very positive!

    Favourite decks/cards aside, looking at the format as a whole, does anyone feel like there is a card (or cards) that need to be restricted, and there is sufficient data backing the claim?


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