Shops with 4x Golem was not over-powered (I won a P9 with 4 MM, 3 flusterstorm, 1 spell pierce maindeck). However Shops promoted pretty bad gameplay. So be it.
If Gush gets restricted tokens blue is still going to be very strong. The maximum artifact mana mentor decks are already good. If Gush gets restricted its easier to cut islands and run artifact mana. People could run things like Dark Confidant to make up for the loss of draw spells. BK ran a version of this deck in the VSL and its a strong deck.
I think they should cut the number of vintage dialy events. With less events per week it will be easier to get the events to fire.
Alternatively the community should pick 2 daily events and try to "promote" those. The 10pm friday one seems like a good pick. But we should also pick on earlier in the day. Maybe one of the early events on Saturday.
I am pretty sure I would not do any better. However I was mostly reacting to this post by you.
"that's just how magic works . if 2 people on a similar level of skill play each other with decks that are 50+ cards identical, if those remaining cards aren't completely dominating the matchup, the guy with the better draw will win. sure, there's a difference between snuff out and swords to plowshares, cabal therapy and mentor. but at the end of the day that difference isn't all that much, especially if the identical cards are stuff like ancestral, time walk, lotus, moxes etc."
I don't agree with this claim. I maybe should have been clearer that is why I mentioned the clear misplays in the VSL. In the cases I cited people where not playing the same deck-lists. But I don't see why this is critical. If people lose to misplays in asymmetric mus I don't see why they wouldn't lose to misplays in symmetric mus.
I agree many msiplays don't matter. But they often do. In addition to randy vs Efro there was also the Owen vs Kai match (Owen had a kill on board with Yawg will). We are now up to 2/45 regular season games decided on clear mistakes.
I personally find it likely that many more games were decided on less clear mistakes. But then its much harder to cite evidence, as people can dispute if the misplays would have mattered (or even if they were misplays).
I do however agree that luck is extremely important! This is magic lol.
Also I don't want to insult people but a rather non-trivial number of games in the VSL have been decided by clear msiplays. For example when Randy played vs efro he lost 0-2. I am pretty sure Randy was favored to win 2-0 with better play. One game he missed hangerback for zero. The other game he didn't leave up mana to replay containment priest in case Efro had chain of vapor. The threat he played was not needed that turn. There is also that Owen game but owen is not actually a VSL member.
Of course only a small number of matches have been decided by clear unambiguous misplays. But there are only 45 regular season VSL games per season. And every regular season there are several clear, match deciding mistakes. I am sure there are many matches were decided by less clear misplays.
Steve Menendian might yell at me for saying this but I don’t really think of Gush as a “strategy” anymore. The classical “gush deck” runs a low number of mana sources and relies on gush+cantrips. This lets the deck get “virtual card advantage” vs higher mana control strategies To me “low mana” in vintage means 17-19 mana sources. These “classic gush” strategies are very effective. For example both the decks in the finals of the last power9 ran 19 mana sources and 3-4 gush: http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/mtgo-standings/vintage-premier-2016-06-26 . Though one should note
However it's hard for me to think of these as fundamentally gush decks. People are having success with Gush deck running very varied amounts of mana. The “Sylvan mentor” decks that were dominating vintage always ran high mana sources. From 18 all the way up to 24. You can see examples in the 4-0 and 3-1 decklists in the dailies. For examples see:
For an example of a 24-mana source deck with mentor-gush see LSV’s last vSL deck: http://magic.wizards.com/en/MTGO/articles/archive/magic-online/vintage-super-league-season-5-decklists (note this only has 2 gush).
I personally think Gush is just a fundamentally strong card. Steve is probably right that Gush is a turn3+ play. But any deck that is ok with “turn3+” cards and has 12 islands/fetches should probably run 2-3 gush imo. If you run 13+ islands/fetches then 3 gush is probably right! (running 4 gush is very sketchy even with 14 islands/fetches. I would know as I have been doing it for months!) . I have even tested a copy of gush in a petition storm deck and the gush was pretty good. The card is extremely flexible (if you have islands).
Restricting gush on power-level makes a ton of sense. The card doesn’t actually require much support. However the decks running gush are fairly diverse. So I could also see not restricting gush. Also note that even specifically mentor has a ton of the metagame share.
The previous times were better imo. 6pm GMT and midnight GMT. The current later Daily is held at 2am GMT. This is 10pm on the East coast. Any "late" daily is too late for Europe, but a 10pm Daily is also too late for the East coast of the USA.
Ever since they switched schedules less dailies have fired in my experience. The only Dailies I feel I can rely on are the 6pm GMT dailies on weekends.
I personally feel the times for the current dailies are far from optimal. Does the manadrain agree? If we agree the event times are bad is their anything we can do? Maybe the manadrain can send a statement to wizards. Or perhaps we can get someone "famous" to complain?
This was also mentioned in the VSL thread. So I am re-posting what I said there about why Kai possibly should have waited:
The advantage I see of waiting is that you can use Dack Fayden targetting Owen to make him draw2 when he just has Darksteel in deck. Next turn you can grindstone owen with a pyroblast up. You can also gridnstone Owen in response to him playing spells (for example a draw spell). If Owen goes land->Yawgmoth will you can grindstone owen in response to him playing a mana source out of his discard.
If you wait you do lose to owen having a swords+ counterspell. Its hard for owen to win with a yawgmoth's will line if you wait. If owen plays anything else from his hand except yawgmoth will+mana source he can't get up to 8 cards. I believe if Owen plays something like a preordain you can therefore gridnstone him in response. If Owen plays mox into yawgmoth will you have to counter the Yawgmoth will. If owen counters back he probably can't get to 8 cards in hand.
Its a hard line to play
@Kai The advantage I see of waiting is that you can use Dack Fayden targetting Owen to make him draw2 when he just has Darksteel in deck. Next turn you can grindstone owen with a pyroblast up. You can also gridnstone Owen in response to him playing spells (for example a draw spell). If Owen goes land->Yawgmoth will you can grindstone owen in response to him playing a mana source out of his discard.
If you wait you do lose to owen having a swords+ counterspell. Its hard for owen to win with a yawgmoth's will line if you wait. If owen plays anything else from his hand except yawgmoth will+mana source he can't get up to 8 cards. I believe if Owen plays something like a preordain you can therefore gridnstone him in response. If Owen plays mox into yawgmoth will you have to counter the Yawgmoth will.
Owen had a winning line in game1 vs Kai.
Start of turn: 8 cards in hand
Yawgmoth Will (the rest of plays are from the graveyard)
3 other mox (edit: sapphire is not available)
Lotus (5 tokens, 7 available mana)
Alternate Cost Gush
Counter Gush with Fluster
Time walk (8 tokens)
Now you have 8 cards in hand. Discard blightsteel.
On your next turn you can cast voltaic key+Sensei's top to pump the tokens.
This works right?
I like the top8 decks.
I feel like my deck was unfavored in the finals. @diophan had a better "card advantage" gameplan. Its hard to win the control game vs 4 cabal therapy + 1 fluster/1pyroblast even though I also had alot of counters. My mentor build is/was not that fast.
I really like @diophan 's deck and I think he played well in our games. He deserved to win this thing imo.
I personally don't care if people ask their friends/twitch viewers for advice when they play me. Alot of the fun of mtgo vintage comes from streaming and playing with friends. Actually the thing that bothers me the most in paper and online mtg is that some players have better knowledge of what deck their opponents are on. If you know someone is on shops/dredge/etc game1 you have a huge advantage in terms of mulligan decisions and turn1 plays.
I do however think it is clearly cheating to watch a stream of someone you are battling. Even if the rule is unenforceable.
Some version of El Drazi might have a good mentor mu. Though we will have to see how the Eldrazi deck shakes out. The popular mono-white eldrazi build is not optomized for bating mentor game1. For example it often runs maindeck containment priest.
See the 4-0 deck-list here: