@Daniel-Worobec @ajfirecracker I have a lot to say about this because I have thought a lot about Dredge sideboards.
I have found that most Pitch Dredge decks use a creature to give your other creatures haste such as Flame-kin Zealot and Dragonlord Kolaghan. While both are effective they are neither blue nor green that can be exiled to Force of Will or Force of Vigor. I believe Maelstrom Wanderer is a good alternative to be added to Pitch Dredge that is both blue, green and can be exiled to cast Force of Will and Force of Vigor and should be added as the “Haste” creature.
I think this is a really good idea with some good reasoning behind. I think that the inclusion of "pro-active" cards like [[Force of Vigor]], and creatures (duh). I think with the inclusion of [[Maelstrom Wanderer]] increases the value of [[Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis]] as it is a bigger payoff to Cascade into than most of our cards (being either small creatures or counter spells).
Sideboard option one:
4x Force of Vigor
4x Noxious Revival
3x Shambling Shell
I have done quite a bit of testing with [[Noxious Revival]] and I am pretty confident that in a "normal" Pitch Dredge shell you often want 2-3 but that 4 is to many. Also as @ajfirecracker said there is little to no value of playing Dredge cards in the SB.
I find that adding four Noxious Revival would be good candidates for being cards that you can exile to Force of Vigor. Noxious Revival is a good utility cards in Pitch Dredge decks allowing you to recover a Bazaar of Baghdad and getting a second Bazaar from your graveyard. Noxious Revival is also good at getting utility cards from your graveyard such as Force of Will, Force of Vigor or getting a Hollow One into your hand. Other applications include putting a card onto of your opponent’s deck that they may not want, saving a Bridge from Below from being exiled and putting a Narcomoeba on top of your library.
Yes! Noxious Revival is a very good card in my opinion for the Dredge SB and I think is a necessity in the current version as they are a lot weaker to waste effects than they have been in the past. As you can tell there are many, many uses to Noxious Revival and I have been very nicely impressed with it. My biggest complaint with it is that it is yet another source of card disadvantage in a deck with 8-12 pieces of card disadvantage which can lead to you being unable to fully capitalize on its power at times.
Sideboard option two:
4x Force of Vigor
4x Basking Rootwalla
3x Vengevine
Again, like @ajfirecracker said I do not think [[Vengevine]] has a spot in the SB of Dredge as it is weak to all of the same things that our other creatures are. [[Basking Rootwalla]] is a card that I really like and have thought about a lot in the past and I think can spawn a new type of SB for Dredge because of [[Force of Negation]] (I will expand on this later).
In my play testing I do find that getting the appropriate combinations of cards into your hand is inconsistent.
Ah, yes. The biggest advantage of [[Bazaar of Baghdad]] can also be its biggest weakness at times. This comes back to my point of not being able to fully capitalize on your powerful cards because you are so low on resources (ie you cannot resolve the cards you are digging for or you cannot dig as efficiently or quickly as you would like because you have so few cards in hand)> I have a few ideas on this later.
Sideboard option three:
4x Force of Vigor
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
2x Nature’s Claim
I like this and recognize that it is not a complete SB but you most likely need some answers to [[Containment Priest]].
With the London Mulligan taking into effect soon, Pitch Dredge may not rely on Serum Powder as much and there may be decks that do not include Serum Powder.
I think this statement is very risky. If you look at the math you are roughly 97% to hit Bazaar without [[Serum Powder]] with the London Mulligan, yet with [[Serum Powder]] you are roughly 99%. Now assuming you lose every game where you do not have [[Bazaar of Baghdad]] in your opener and that you have a 50% win rate (when you have Bazaar in your opener) then the inclusion of Serum Powder boosts your overall expected win rate by roughly 1% (it is actually a bit more I think), and this number goes up the better player you are! So to cut [[Serum Powder]] you would have to find a set of 4 cards that boosts your win rate by more than roughly 1% for it to be worth it. Is that possible? Most likely. Have we found what cards yet? I am not convinced. Additionally Serum Powder increases the average number of cards in our opening hand which is also heavily correlated with winning the game for Dredge.
Notable creatures to put in Pitch Dredge to help support Force cards are Domia, Sage of Stone, Muldrotha, the Gravetide, Prophet of Kruphix and Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis.
I think [[Damia, Sage of Stone]] is a possibility as it allows us to have more cards in hand (more countermagic, resources), digging power, and speed but I think it may be win-more. If you could [[Dread Return]] a Damia is it better than Dread Returning an FKZ or DLK (most likely winning you the game on the spot)? As for [[Muldrotha, the Gravetide]] I think that you need to heavily tune your list for this to be playable as there is nothing we can play from the GY for value that we can not already, if you made a more land heavy list with Loams and such then it could be alright. [[Prophet of Kruphix]] seems really bad to me, not enough lands in the deck to use it, might as well DR a huge green creature. Hogaak seems worthwhile, not because he pitches (we want it to be blue and green for that) but rather because he seems viable post SB as he can be cast from GY through Priest and can be cast through Cage from hand for free.
4x Bazaar of Baghdad
4x Bridge from Below
4x Stinkweed Imp
4x Cabal Therapy
4x Hollow One
2x Ichorid
2x Dread Return
1x Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
4x Narcomoeba
4x Prized Amalgam
4x Force of Will
4x Mental Misstep
3x Force of Negation
1x Maelstrom Wanderer
4x Force of Vigor
4x Noxious Revival
4x Golgari Grave-Troll
3x Shambling Shell
This seems like a good starting 60, but I think you want to shave some [[Shambling Shell]]s for an [[Ichorid]] and a [[Force of Negation]]
I am now going to provide a few 60s and 75s that I think have some theoretical merit and will explain why.
# 1st List: May 4th Dredge
## "Normal" Pitch Dredge with Force of Vigor
Engine (8):
4 Bazaar of Baghdad
4 Serum Powder
Dredgers (9):
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
1 Shambling Shell
Payoff(27):
4 Bridge from Below
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Narcomoeba
4 Prized Amalgam
3 Ichorid
2 Dread Return
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Maelstrom Wanderer
4 Hollow One
Interaction (16):
4 Force of Will
4 Mental Misstep
4 Force of Negation
4 Force of Vigor
This is a pretty normal looking MD with some of the changes I suggested you make. I did not include the SB because I think it is one of the most complex and important decisions for Dredge.
For this version the SB needs to include between 2 or 3 of the following:
- Answers to GY hate (an the means to execute it).
- Another axis of attack.
- Redundancy.
The Antihate SB
Now when you break into option #1 you have a few targets. You must be able to deal with the following effects/cards as efficiently as possible:
Spheres
[[Wasteland]]
[[Containment Priest]]
[[Grafdigger's Cage]]
[[Leyline of the Void]]
Countermagic
[[Tormod's Crypt]]
[[Pithing Needle]]
[[Yixlid Jailer]]*
[[Rest in Peace]]*
Now the ones with a * are rarer or lower quality concerns because they are either not very good (RiP) or not very popular (Yixlid Jailer).
Now most SB include very broad and efficient answer such as [[Nature's Claim]] or [[Chain of Vapor]]. Because Force of Vigor fits this role we may be able to more carefully curate our SB with more powerful or narrow cards to be able to beat certain specific cards or matchups. With this in mind I propose Survival all-star, pet card of mine, and a card I have been thinking about a lot and testing a bit, [[Squee, Goblin Nabob]]. Yes, you read that right. Squee. In a Dredge SB. Here is the thing though, in matchups or situations where you GY is not permanently exiled (which is a decent amount since only 2 of the above cards achieve this) he is insane. While you GY may be "locked down" or you are unable to get your normal value out of it, Squee operates on a different axis than our other value as nothing is put onto the battlefield or cast, getting around Priest, Cage and Countermagice. Additionally he solves one of the biggest issues I have mentioned with Pitch lists; low resources (not many cards in hand). With Squee operation you are not only able to dig much more efficiently but your hand size will increase by 1 every turn provided you are not doing anything else. This is very important if you are looking for something like a Hollow One and want to keep your Countermagic live or the where you want to find your land for your anti-hate spell. As promised here is a suggested rough draft antihate SB along with a note on what role each card serves:
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob (Utility)
2 Noxious Revival (Utility/Answer)
4 Gemstone Mine (Mana)
1 Mana Confluence (Mana)
1 Vengeful Pharaoh (Disruption/Answer)
3 Chain of Vapor (Answer)
3 Nature's Claim (Answer)
The Delver SB
This is my take on option #2 (for @ajfirecracker it used to be Marit Lage).
4 Squee (Utility)
3 Noxious Revival (Utility/Answer)
4 Basking Rootwalla (Transformation)
1 Strip Mine (Disruption)?
1 Wasteland (Disruption)?
2 Hogaak (with some MD)
So this SB is extremely theoretical so far but the new Forces + Hogaak allow you to have what I think is a sufficient critical mass of not only free creatures that do not rely directly rely on the GY but also Counters to "ride" these highly efficient creatures to victory. This strategy is somewhat similar to Delver decks in Legacy but taken to the extreme. @brianpk80 has been very vocal recently about how Hollow One allows Dredge to "transform" into a Delver deck and I think this SB is mean to capitalize on that idea to the max. The Strip Mine and Wastelands are there because I would imagine you need a few lands in the Shops matchup, because it furthers your disruption while again being on a different axis and because it could really help you in the mirror.
I wanted to also just throw a few decklists out there to get more ideas brewing and to think of how the 60 impacts and complements the final 15.
# 2nd List: Vintage BridgeVine
## My take on @ajfirecracker 's idea of Vengevine Dredge
Engine (8):
4 Bazaar of Baghdad
4 Serum Powder
Dredgers (8):
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
Payoff(28):
4 Bridge from Below
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Narcomoeba
3 Prized Amalgam
1 Ichorid
4 Hollow One
4 Vengevine
4 Basking Rootwalla
2 Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis
Interaction (16):
4 Force of Will
4 Mental Misstep
4 Force of Negation
4 Force of Vigor
Sideboard (15):
4 Squee, Goblin Nabob
3 Noxious Revival
1 Strip Mine
2 Wasteland
3 Walking Ballista
2 Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis
# 3rd List: Manaless Dredge
## True Manaless Pitch Dredge
Engine (8):
4 Bazaar of Baghdad
4 Serum Powder
Dredgers (9):
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
1 Shambling Shell
Payoff(27):
4 Bridge from Below
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Narcomoeba
4 Prized Amalgam
3 Ichorid
2 Dread Return
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Maelstrom Wanderer
4 Hollow One
Interaction (16):
4 Force of Will
4 Mental Misstep
4 Force of Negation
4 Force of Vigor
Sideboard:
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
2 Noxious Revival
4 Basking Rootwalla
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Nature's Claim
# 3rd List: Blue.dec
## How much interaction is to much? (How to piss off BPK)
Engine (8):
4 Bazaar of Baghdad
4 Serum Powder
Dredgers (9):
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
1 Shambling Shell
Payoff(19):
4 Bridge from Below
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Narcomoeba
4 Prized Amalgam
3 Ichorid
Interaction (24):
4 Force of Will
4 Mental Misstep
4 Force of Negation
4 Force of Vigor
4 Mindbreak Trap
4 Unmask
Sideboard (15):
4 Hollow One
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland
4 Squee, Goblin Nabob
3 Noxious Revival
Please let me know your thoughts and suggestions. If I made any mistakes or did something dumb please let me know as I stayed up way to late trying to do this since I got excited. I have many more ideas on the subject and have discussed it a lot and cannot wait to begin testing on MODO soon (PS if anybody is looking to sell Dredge on MTGO for a nice price PM me).
Edit: Fixed some counting stuff cause I am tired and bad at math. Also realized none of these lists have any GY hate so that could be an issue in an open meta.
this version of dredge is a lot older than Pitch Dredge. It relies on the explosive power of an unearthed Fatestitcher to continue Bazaaring and to eventually Dread Return a Sun Titan or Molderhulk. This variant is by far the quickest, but it uses many more slots than other versions.