Brassy dropping truth.
Also: do Vintage players just hate each other? Why would you ever want to Channel Emrakul or Flash Hulk someone?
Running more lands helps in exactly one aspect against Shops, and that is in increasing your odds of having Ingot Chewer/etc. mana in your post board mulligans to 6 or 5.
In all other situations the decks that played more lands but more expensive curves (@wappla would say they played worse Divinations) were NO better at actually doing stuff against Shops.
Never forget that mana is chosen to support a CURVE. It's not just some willy nilly decision to jam more land and BOOM you win more. Otherwise we would have seen more 5-lands-in-sideboards.
And, it's not actually clear that your typical big-curve blue shells even strategically or tactically advance from having better opening hand spot artifact removal. The tempo gained might literally not matter when your important spells cost 4 and don't attack and block effectively. It's very likely that this is a net WIN for Shops precisely because people are forced to play higher-mana, higher-curve, do-nothing strategies.
@Hrishi you're not nearly as good as Steve and trying to literally interpret statements in arguments. As in, he usually does it well, and you did it really poorly here.
It's pretty obvious from the WORDING of the tweet that player feedback > other stuff.
And if you're going to argue that player feedback made them think about the restriction but didn't play the same role in them following through... well, that kind of mental gymnastics on the order of thinking restricting Gush is good for the format.
Aaron Forsythe was pretty clear on Twitter that player feedback trumped logic and data on this B&R decision. So blame your fellow players.
"The catalyst for B&R changes to ANY format is player feedback (then we go to data, design theory, & testing). So thank you for all feedback!"
If you're a Vintage player who has no interest in advancing the format and would rather play Control Slaver mirrors for a decade, congrats! You have a 'voice'.
Mentor is either going to be terribly unplayable or too good, which is exactly what it was before the restrictions.
Such a binary outcome is not very interesting.
The expression "anyone with half a brain can see..." and I am interested to know the number of brains involved.
The move doesn't make a whole lot of sense. It encourages people to play more Moxen and fewer creatures that attack and block for small chunks, which is the opposite direction this format needs to go. I'm hoping I'm not the only one to whom that is so baldly obvious.
Plus doing this suggests that whining is rewarded over logic/reason, which I guess I shouldn't be surprised by when Chalice/Lodestone caved, but it still rankles.
Nevertheless. First-turn-kill combo didn't get appreciably better. They didn't do a ban. They didn't restrict any of the really critical stuff like Force of Will. They didn't unrestrict any of of the real critical stuff like Lotus Petal. I suppose we should chalk it up as a small victory that the format isn't smouldering in ashes right now.
I think a Mentor restriction is worth considering but the absolute weakest justification or reinforcement I can think of for it is a poll of Vintage players at large. From past experience, such an endorsement of an idea is often a good sign that the idea is deeply flawed.
Interesting to note the specific user who rebroadcast that poll here.
No comment on the undertones re; Gush. Enough had been said on the subject.
@gkraigher that's an easily testable statement because most decks run 10-20 lands so we can see if this is better than even 1 out of 20 lands in current strategies.
Gush of all varieties: no
Shops of all varieties: no
White bears of all varieties: no
Old school combo control: no
BUG control: no
Paradox combo: no
Does it enable something new or exciting? Maybe... but you pay for it dearly. More than 19 of 20 lands in the format either tap for colored mana, tap for multiple mana, or have an ability worth at least half a mana.
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