Our website guy (me) finally got off his fat ass and posted the podcast we recorded about this:
Posts made by thecravenone
RE: 9 September 2017 Proxy Vintage for Harvey Relief @4th Tap [21 players]
RE: Two Card Monte
As Ben has said, Welder is questionable.
Is Gemstone Mine preferable to City of Brass? As Sean noted before, Chromatic Lantern might also be a good option if you're worried about getting enough colored mana.
Why Jar and Wheel but no Twister or Windfall?
I like a bot if I'm gonna play Tinker.
Why the Pyroblast/REB split?
9/24/17 Houston, TX - 100% PROXY Vintage @Brash Brewing Co
Date: September 24th, 2017
Location: Brash Brewing Company 508 W Crosstimbers Rd, Houston, TX 77018 [MAP]
Registration Time: 12:30 PM
Event Begins: 1:00 PM
Entry Fee: $10 - EXACT CHANGE ONLY
Payout: TBD, see below.
Proxy limit: Unlimited proxy
Proxy rules: Don't make us need to make a proxy rule!
About Brash Brewing
Getting there: [MAP] Google Maps places 508 a bit off. If you're heading West on Crosstimbers, be in the right lane. Immediately after some apartments, you'll see a small driveway with a tall wooden fence and then some more apartments. That driveway is where you want to be! [pic]
Most of the tables at Brash are picnic style tables so a playmat would definitely be a good idea.
Cash: We payout ~80% of entry fee in cash top top 4. The remainder is kept to pay for the prize wall, playmat, and tournament expenses.
Here's what the "prize wall" looks like as of 13 August.
Brash has offered a free crowler of beer to our first place winner.
At least one player outside of the top 4 will win a door prize at the end of the event, so be sure to stick around and play out all your matches!
We have a Stanley-Cup-esque playmat. Each tournament, the playmat is be inscribed with the date, location, and winner of the tournament, along with some space for the player to add a doodle. This playmat will be passed each week to the new champion to play with at the next tournament! The finished mat from last season looks like this:
If anyone is planning on coming from out of town, please contact one of the Houston crew if you'd like us to arrange something post-Magic. After most big Legacy events, we generally go out as a group to avail ourselves of the city's excellent food and drink options, and we'd love to show them off to you, too!
If you or someone you know needs a deck and is too lazy to use a printer or doesn't know what they want, we usually have a few available to borrow. You're welcome to take them home. We only ask that you buy us a new pack of sleeves so we can replace the deck.
Decklists are required. We do not perform deck checks but we want lists so we can post them. Have bad handwriting? Use the decklist generator here! Blank deck registration sheets will be available on site. Please don't put anything on your decklist that you don't want to be seen publicly as your decklist may be scanned and uploaded in full.
It would be greatly appreciated if your decklist was filled out and ready before our scheduled start time of 1PM.
RE: [IMA] Change to rules on Blood Moon effects
So this means you're no longer allowed to name a creature type when you play caverns under a moon effect.
To clarify, Cavern will never ask you for a creature type. I'd probably still "name" one in an attempt to confuse my opponent.
Eternal Extravaganza 7 Results
EE7 decklists have been posted. Top 16 as links for convenience:
- Ryan Glackin - Sun Titan Dredge
- Michael Scheffenacker - Ravager Shops
- Timothy Candee - Dredge
- Nicholas Dijohn - Ravager Shops
- Joe Brennan - BUG
- Hank Zhong - UWR Mentor
- Nathaniel Riggs - Foundry Shops
- Daniel Barkon - Ravager Shops
- Brenden Mccarley - UR Delver
- Mike Canzanella - BUG
- Jostin Rodriguez - Ravager Shops
- John Grudzina - BUG
- David Long - Pitch Dredge
- Wilson Hunder - Paradoxical Storm
- Jose Ortiz - Ravager Shops
- Keith Seals - Dredge
By deck type:
This is likely the biggest event before Eternal Weekend. If anyone has further metagame breakdown, that'd be great for EW prep!
RE: [Primer] Oath
"Show and Tell dodges much of the most common Oath hate, including both Grafdigger's Cage and Containment Priest."
Show and Tell certainly doesn't dodge Containment Priest if you plan on Showing a dude.
My editor is Howard G. "Ward" Cunningham.
Unlike many other "decks" that might receive primers, Oath is not truly one deck. Rather, it is the foundation upon which several decks are built. The foundation is as follows. Using the one-card-combo that is Oath of Druids, fueled by the token generation of Forbidden Orchard, get a high-value creature into play as early as turn two.
The creatures used in Oath have varied dramatically over the years. They generally fit into one of two categories; creatures that help you win a control game and creatures that help you win with a combo. More recently, players have converged on Griselbrand as the creature of choice. His card-drawing ability allows for either role to be played while representing a three-turn clock.
Sorceries (12)1 Ponder
Artifacts (10)1 Mox Jet1 Mox Ruby1 Sol Ring
Lands (16)2 Island
Sideboard(15)1 Forest1 Karakas
This is more or less the baseline build of Oath. Essentially, this is a Big Blue shell with the Oath of Druids combo and a couple of supporting pieces added. It looks to get a Griselbrand into play as quickly as possible, then draw cards to protect itself and ensure a win. This build includes a Tezeret the Seeker alongside Time Vault and Voltaic Key as alternative win conditions. (Some people consider this addition to qualify it as a separate deck. As it's only 3 cards added, I've included it here for brevity.)
Show and Tell
Control Oath decks will often play 2-4 Show and Tell, acting as Oath of Druids numbers five through eight. Show and Tell dodges much of the most common Oath hate, including
bothGrafdigger's Cage and Containment Priest. While its ability is, on paper, symetrical, it is often low-risk in today's format dominated by Workshops and Mentors*. This is especially true when combined with the 2-4 Thoughtseize that the control Oath player will likely be playing.
*This is what I get for not finishing writing this before a B&R update.
Show and Tell Tip 1:
It makes for excellent bait and does not need to be used exclusively as a replacement Oath. Play Show and Tell first to test whether your opponent has a counter. If they do, that's fine, you'll play Oath next. If they don't, use Show and tell to put Oath into play.
Show and Tell Tip 2:
If you've got an Oath on board that your opponent is shutting down with a Graffdigger's Cage, you can "tutor" for an Oath target. Allow Oath to resolve. You'll mill some cards until you hit your target. That card will now go back on top of your library and you will draw it for the turn. Now just pay 2U and baby, you got a stew goin'!
Oath of Druids is going to dump a lot of cards into your graveyard. Therefore, there are a lot of syngergies in Oath decks that take advantage of that. The first, and most obvious choice is Yawgmoth's Will. The milling of Oath turns Will into a virtual draw-20 (sometimes more!)
In control decks, Will is often used to sculpt the hand, clear up opposing threats, and in general, assure victory over the course of the next few turns. In combo decks, barring an extremely hateful boardstate, even a modest Oath mill combined with Will is likely to result in immediate victory as critical mass is effectively achieved as soon as Will resolves.
Sometimes, there are cards that you just don't want in your graveyard. Memory's Journey allows you to return a card to your deck to be later drawn or tutored for. This can allow a single card to be played many times in a single turn when combined with Yawgmoth's Will.
Again, some graveyard synergy. Hopefully, Dragon Breath is milled before your Oath target is. If it is, for the low cost of (R), you can give it Haste!
I don't really know what to say here. If a flying Yawgmoth's Bargain is good, a flying Demonic Tutor has to be good too, right?
Common Oath Decks
When I originally started writing this, I had nearly a dozen lists pasted in line. However, the difference between the Oath deck above and those below is often only a "package" of a few cards. I've decided to instead just post the package. If you'd like a full list for one of these decks, you should be able to find one quite easily.
This build is quite similar to the "base" build. However, it adds the combination of Grove of the Burnwillows and Punishing Fire with Life from the Loam to return a destroyed or milled Grove. This combo helps to clean up opposing Mentors and its tokens as well as Workshop's less-costly creatures. Oh, and it kills Containment Priest, too! In a pinch, Grove + Punishing Fire can even act as a slow clock.
Saheeli Oath / Sun Titan Oath / Sun Rai
Sun Titan has long been played in Oath decks as a way to get back powerful permanents milled away by Oath. More recently, Saheeli Rai has joined the mix. Saheeli makes a copy of Sun Titan to bring your on-board power up to 12 and trigger a new return from the Titan. One (or more) of those Titans will then attack, getting you yet another trigger. Finally, Sun Titan is certainly the most easily cast Oath target that will be discussed in this post!
The first few decks were essentially Big Blue variants with Oath added. These are essentially storm decks with Oath added. There are three storm variants for Oath.
I wanted to start here but unfortunately, this has become so infrequently played that I couldn't find a recent deck. Basically, this deck is exactly as described above; a Perfect Storm deck with Oath for Griselbrand acting as a super-fast, easy to cast Yawgmoth's Bargain.
Posting a full decklist for this one as it's so much different than those posted thus far:
Sorceries (11)1 Tinker1 Windfall
Artifacts (18)1 Mox Jet1 Mox Ruby1 Sol Ring2 Mox Opal
Sideboard (15)1 Balance1 Duress2 Mountain
As with Comboath, this deck is basically an existing deck, Burning Tendrils, with Oath added as additional Yawgmoth's Bargains.
Paradoxical Oath trades the traditional storm shell for the new Paraodixal Storm shell.
This deck was first described to me as, "Tendrils with training wheels," and I must admit that it certainly feels like that. For someone wanting to try Oath but not wanting to start with a more "vanilla" build, I'd recommend starting here.
Golden Gun Oath
Named for the one-shot kill of the Golden Gun in James Bond video games, this version of the deck looks to kill you immediately upon Oath's trigger resolving. The goal is to Oath into Blightsteel Colossus, attach a Dragon Breath, and immediately swing for lethal. It is quite possible for this deck to win without allowing its opponenet a turn.
Salvagers Oath / Bomberman Oath
This build adds the Bomberman combo. When triggering Oath, you're looking to both put Auriok Salvagers into play and Pyrite Spellbomb into the graveyard. Salvagers is often paired with another Oath target to allow multiple play options.
This build may be worse than other modern Bomberman builds as they've begun to adopt Walking Ballista as a much faster kill, which cannot be safely played alongside oath.
- Auriok Salvagers
- Pyrite Spellbomb
And here's some other Oath deck names I was given that I was unable to find decklists for:
- 2 Angel
- Ham Salad
- Oath checks on trigger and on resolution. If you don't have more creatures than them at the start of your upkeep, it won't trigger.
- Sometimes it may be worth it to Oath into a duplicate or into something that won't actually hit the battlefield due to fueling Yawg's or Memory's Journey
- They've got a cage, you've got enough mana to cast: mill, duder stays on top, draw and cast duder.
9 September 2017 Proxy Vintage for Harvey Relief @4th Tap [21 players]
The Lone Star Lhurgoyfs are, of course, based in the great state of Texas. While tha majority of us are based in Houston, we do have members spread througout the state. Stu was looking to mirror the every-other-week cadence of Houston Vintage in Austin. So we planned to bring the Houston Vintage crew to Austin.
And then Hurricane Harvey hit.
Breaking many records and getting its name retired before disapating, Hurricane Harvey throrughly fucked the Texas Gulf Coast. We decided that the already-scheduled Austin tournament would be modified to benefit Hurricane Harvey relief. The entry fee was nearly tripled and the prize pool was juiced as never before. We acquired so many prizes from donations that in addtion to the usual prize pool, we added a raffle for further prizes.
In the end, we counted $922 donated to The American Red Cross benefiting Hurricane Harvey relief.
Many thanks to the following who donated cash, cards, and logistics, the Austin Magic community for coming out and throwing money at us, and the rest of ya'll who have given in any other way.
- 4th Tap Brewing Co-op
- Matt Murray
- Nick Patniyot
- Pat's Games
- Patrick Brennan
- Sean Obrien and Team Tusk
- Stu Ziarnik
- Tim Everett
Results and deck lists:
- Chris Huckabee - Dredge
- Steven Whitehead - BUG
- Ben Kendrick - Tezzeret Oath
- Tim Everett - Merfolk
- Benjamin Kennedy - Ravager Shops
- Jacob Baltz - Grixis Painter
- Nick Patniyot - Salvagers Oath
- William Lo - Blue Moon
- Patrick Brennan - Ravager Shops
- Michael O'Malley - 5 Color Humans
- Sean Liu - UR Delver
- Robert Connolly - Moon Stompy
- David Hibbs - Baleful Control
- Stuart Ziarnik - Null Rod Shops
- Johny Angulo - Hatebears
- Rose Queirolo - White Eldrazi
- Bryan Hockey - Oath
- Patrick Vincent - UW Landsstill
- Tweedy - UR Delver
- Sam Craven - Two Card Monte
- Matt Jordan - Oath
The Goyfs meet up for some pre-Vitnage chow
Beer menu at 4th Tap
Our final prize pool
Some of Robert's cool foil proxies
Dredge takes down game one of the finals.
Steven starts game two of the finals with a Leyline of the Void - it's not looking good for Dredge!
A Hollow Man powers through multiple pieces of hate to take down the tournament!
[IMA] Change to rules on Blood Moon effects
From the Iconic Masters Release Notes, specifically about Magus of the Moon:
If a nonbasic land has an ability that applies "as [this land] enters the battlefield" or that causes it to enter the battlefield tapped or with counters, the land will lose that ability before it applies. This is a change from previous rules.
RE: Second Place at 21 player Lone Star Lhurogoyf full proxy event September 9 2017
RE: The Official Fantasy Card Design Thread
Tomb Of Souls
When ~ enters play choose a creature type.
T: Add 2 mana of any color to you mana pool. This mana can only be spent to cast creatures of the chosen type.
So this is Cavern +1 mana of any color for creatures and -<> mana? Seems way too good.
RE: Eternal Extravaganza 7 in Philly!!!!
At least TMD doesn't make you scan and upload a government ID to prove identity. FB is awful.
I have never done this. Have you done this?
He probably hasn't but it has been reported before
This is still not on the TOA calendar.
RE: The Reserve List - The Reddest Red Herring
That is, for the most part, people do not argue about accessibility to Legacy or Vintage as such, but instead argue about how they want to own (or want others to own) very specific cards: Tundras, or Libraries of Alexandia, or Black Lotuses. Often the argument boils down to the thought that old formats need more of these particular cards to survive in paper, and if they don’t get them, then the formats are doomed to a slow and doddering death.
Link to data set:
You've brought this argument but I think you've done a poor job dismissing it. Of these three examples, the average scores for substitutes are, out of six, 2.75, not listed, and 2.67. The best card you've listed as a replacement for any of these examples is only a 4. I think this further strengthens the argument against your argument.
Edit: read some scores wrong.
RE: The Relative Values of Data
So I open this question to everyone because I am curious how various different minds are looking at it: what data sets are you prioritizing when looking at the health of the format?
I have no ability to impact the "health" of the format. I can certainly opine on it, but given that I can't do anything about it, I'm not going to put in the time to analyze a bunch of datasets that each have flaws.
That being said, the data is still useful for building a rubric for what I need to be prepared to face.
- Deck appears in several T8s/undefeated deck listings - Expect to play against this deck
- Deck appears in a couple T8/undefeated deck listings - Be prepared to play against it
- Deck occasionally appears - Be aware of the deck and its plan.
RE: UPDATED 9/9/17 Austin, TX - Hurricane Harvey Benefit Tournament - 100% PROXY Vintage @4th Tap Brewing Cooperative
Updated with prize and other info. Good shit. Come out and play Vintage.
RE: Acting as an Ambassador for Vintage: A Noble Pursuit
This is my favorite link on this site: http://themanadrain.com/tags/not being a douche